Jordan Peterson sits down with author, speaker, and founder and president of the children’s rights organization Them Before Us, Katy Faust. They discuss the ethics of surrogate pregnancies, the importance of both the mother and father in the home, the purpose of marriage being for the child — not the adults, and the abysmal outcomes of no-fault divorce in our culture.
Katy Faust is the founder and president of Them Before Us, a global movement defending children’s right to their mother and father. She publishes, speaks, and testifies widely on why marriage and family are matters of justice for children. Her articles have appeared in Newsweek, USA Today, The Federalist, Public Discourse, WORLD Magazine, The Daily Signal, the Washington Examiner, the American Mind, and the American Conservative. She is on the advisory board for the Alliance for Responsible Citizenship. Katy helped design the teen edition of CanaVox, which studies sex, marriage, and relationships from a natural law perspective. Katy and co-author Stacy Manning detailed their philosophy of worldview transmission in their second book, “Raising Conservative Kids in a Woke City.” She and her pastor husband are raising their four children in Seattle.
This episode was filmed on February 13th, 2025.
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For Katy Faust:
On X
On Instagram
Them Before Us website
Them Before Us on X
Read Katy’s books on parenting:
Them Before Us: Why We Need a Global Children’s Rights Movement (2021)
Raising Conservative Kids in a Woke City: Teaching Historical, Economic, and Biological Truth in a World of Lies (2023)
Pro-Child Politics: Why Every Cultural, Economic, and National Issue Is a Matter of Justice for Children (2024)
| Chapters |
(0:00) Coming up
(0:55) Intro
(5:12) Put children before adults, a child’s right to their life and parents
(9:13) How they cloak destructive child policies in the name of child protection
(11:14) “I did not get into this by choice,” truth tellers and grace givers
(17:29) Debate: gay parenting, surrogate pregnancy, and the three roles of motherhood
(25:58) Desire based maternal or paternal losses, “nobody is donating, they are buying or selling”
(30:57) Faust’s take – is surrogacy ever appropriate?
(34:21) The pre-political rights of the child are rooted in natural law, not desire
(37:33) Maternal and paternal relationships are not substitutable
(47:42) Mary as the archetypal mother, the distinct and complementary roles of mothers and fathers
(52:42) Alleviating bias in parenting studies, the cinderella effect
(59:01) Practical solutions for promoting healthy parenting
(1:06:12) Where the interests of men and women align, “a civilization saving answer”
(1:15:14) Identity in the digital age, setting a proper course for young women
(1:22:57) Hookup culture is a game that serves psychopaths, the value of “no”
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